Episode 78
78: Passion Meets Performance: Tom Kelsey’s Road to 200K Subscribers
https://www.youtube.com/@TomFM
Ever wondered what it takes to turn a gaming passion into a full-time career? In this episode, Kamal sits down with TomFM, a YouTube sensation with nearly 200K subscribers who’s living every football fan’s dream—playing Football Manager for a living. Tom shares his journey from casually watching his dad play Championship Manager to realizing he could actually build a career around his love for the game.
But this isn’t just about gaming; it’s about hustle, adaptability, and the grind that most people overlook. Tom opens up about the sacrifices he’s made, the mental switch that takes him from a social, laid-back guy to a fierce competitor in the YouTube game, and how he reinvented his approach to build a channel with millions of monthly views. Plus, he drops insights on the evolving world of YouTube, the high stakes of viewer engagement, and what it’s really like to sustain a digital career.
In this high-energy episode, Tom and Kamal explore everything from the highs of hitting 100K subscribers to preparing for England's first Football Manager World Cup—yes, virtually! Tune in for a candid look at the grit behind TomFM’s “overnight” success and actionable advice on following your passion to the next level.
Listeners are in for a treat as Kamau Ellis Hyman re-launches the Aim A Little Higher podcast with an engaging conversation featuring Tom Kelsey, one of the most influential content creators in the Football Manager community. Kamau opens the episode by reflecting on the importance of exposure and aspiration in achieving personal growth, setting a motivational tone that speaks directly to the podcast's young audience. As he shares his vision of introducing remarkable individuals under 30, he emphasizes that their stories can serve as guiding lights for listeners striving to elevate their aspirations. The episode serves as a powerful reminder that the paths to success are often paved with resilience, dedication, and the courage to take risks.
Tom takes center stage as he recounts his unique journey from a casual gamer to a full-time YouTuber, captivating the audience with anecdotes that highlight his passion for Football Manager. He shares how his early experiences—watching his father play the game—ignited his interest and laid the foundation for his future in content creation. As Kamau expertly guides the dialogue, Tom reveals the challenges he faced during his initial foray into YouTube, including the struggle for visibility and the long hours spent learning the craft. Their conversation dives into the essence of what it means to build a personal brand: the need to adapt, innovate, and remain authentic to one’s passion. Tom’s insights into the importance of understanding audience dynamics and the value of creating accessible content resonate strongly with aspiring creators.
As the episode progresses, listeners are treated to candid reflections on ambition, competition, and the sacrifices made in pursuit of success. Tom discusses the delicate balance between personal life and work commitments, shedding light on how his drive for improvement sometimes comes at the expense of social connections. The dialogue culminates in a discussion about the future of Tom’s channel and the exciting opportunities that lie ahead, including his role as an assistant manager in an upcoming FIFA E Football Manager World Cup. Kamau’s adept questioning not only highlights Tom’s accomplishments but also encourages listeners to reflect on their own journeys. This episode is a compelling blend of inspiration and practical advice, reminding young listeners that with focus and determination, they too can aim a little higher and achieve their dreams.
Transcript
Yes, yes, yes.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:What's up ladies and gents?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Welcome back to the Aim A Little Higher podcast.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's Kamau Ellis Hyman here bringing the podcast back.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:After a little hiatus, a bit reflecting, a bit of just being out on the road constantly, it's time to bring the podcast back.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:We're very excited for it because we've had a real reflection of what direction to take the podcast and what to do with it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And look, exposure is everything.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:The people you meet, the mindsets you're introduced to.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:We talk about overcoming your circumstances and setting aspirations based and your potential.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But we all know statistically your circumstances are the biggest predictor of where you're going to end up.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So what we've done is we've created a mission to bring the Most impressive under 30s, well, 30 and under, to you.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So you can hear their mindset, so you can hear their missions, you can hear the work they're doing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So you can hear a real report of what it's like out there.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And be inspired.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But not just inspired like oh, it's nice for them, but I mean motivated, motivated to actually take action, to do something.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Because you can see real people who've got real results and are telling you how they did it and not just in a cheesy top line level, but really looking into their journeys and finding out what it really takes to go from high potential to high performance.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And when you set a mission like that, you start to meet the right types of people.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So I started boxing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:During my time at this boxing gym, I met a lad called Tom, Tom Kelsey.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:His subscribers will know him better as Tom fm.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:He is one of the largest football manager content creators in the world.
Kamau Ellis Hyman: w weeks back, he is at around: Kamau Ellis Hyman:Upon releasing it, he's over 200,000 subscribers.
Kamau Ellis Hyman: million times in: Kamau Ellis Hyman:Every time I say that number I have to look back at my notes.
Kamau Ellis Hyman: million times in: Kamau Ellis Hyman:Look, this is a great interview and not just if you're a fan of YouTube or a fan of football manager.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:This is about someone who took a risk on themselves.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You'll find that in the, in the interview about him being in a full time job, taking this risk to take YouTube seriously and what that journey looked like.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You get to learn about patience, resilience, get to learn about sacrifice and what actually took for him to make this happen.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But most importantly for me, from this interview, it's his mindset, the way he looks at YouTube.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:If you take that mindset and put it into any other area of your life, you're going to succeed, you're going to do well.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Because it's not just the vanity numbers, it's the competition, it's the obsession, it's the small details that it constantly adjusts and the mentality to keep on going and keep on pushing forward.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Look, this is a fantastic episode.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You might as well listen to it a couple times.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Really glad to bring this to you as the first one.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Tom absolutely smashed it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And it's my pleasure to introduce you to Tom kelsey of Tom FM on YouTube.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Enjoy.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Tom, welcome to the show, man.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:How are you?
Tom Kelsey:I am very well, thank you.
Tom Kelsey:Thanks for having me.
Tom Kelsey:How are you?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I'm keeping well, man.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I'm keeping well.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I am living the dream because I get to have a guest on who I can actually talk about football with and it's all relevant, which is amazing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Rather than me cramming football in irrelevantly and people being like, why has he gone off on the football rant again today?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I have full permission.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, the more football, the better.
Tom Kelsey:That's what I'm talking about.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Absolutely.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So as.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:As the.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:The intro, let everyone know, like, you are living the.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:The childhood dream of all of us who once used to play on the PlayStation or an Xbox.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:If we had a rubbish machine or the classical PC gamers.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:We had a game we loved and now you get to play that game you love, but also make a career out of it, which is nuts.
Tom Kelsey:It is nuts.
Tom Kelsey:I still can't believe I get to do it as a job.
Tom Kelsey:I have to pinch myself sometimes because it feels like I'm cheating at life, really.
Tom Kelsey:I get to play a video game, put it on the Internet and call it a job.
Tom Kelsey:It's.
Tom Kelsey:It is a dream come true.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, it's fascinating.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Like, I was looking at your, you know, looking for your channel in the 194,000 people have decided I want to follow Tom's journey in football management.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Even though it's completely virtual.
Tom Kelsey:Exactly, yeah.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And it's just absolutely wonderful.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I'd love to know, like, at the beginning, how does this go from you being an everyday dude who picks up a PlayStation Xbox?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:What was your machine and what was it like that first time?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Were you someone who just picked up and you were sick at the game?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So it was like, hey, I'm good at this, I'm going to keep going.
Tom Kelsey:So I first got into football manager when I was.
Tom Kelsey:It was called Championship Manager back then, actually.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, I was about six years old, bizarrely enough, because my dad was playing it.
Tom Kelsey: It was championship manager: Tom Kelsey:So I was about six, seven years old watching my dad play this game.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I go and see him on the computer saying, what are you doing, dad?
Tom Kelsey:And he's playing with Lincoln City.
Tom Kelsey:That's the team I supported.
Tom Kelsey:I was like, wow, you can play as Lincoln City in a video game.
Tom Kelsey:That's.
Tom Kelsey:That's crazy.
Tom Kelsey:And so I think I just was really interested.
Tom Kelsey:I mean, I love footballers anyway, like any kid that sort of age does, that's introduced, that sort of world just falls in love with football.
Tom Kelsey:And so I just.
Tom Kelsey:So I think I got my dad to show me how to play the game, have my own save, taking Lincoln to the Premier League.
Tom Kelsey:And it all just stemmed from there, really having this exposure at such a young age in this video game.
Tom Kelsey:I thought, right, this is one of my favorite games.
Tom Kelsey:And I always came back to it, playing it on and off over years and different editions of the game.
Tom Kelsey:But it wasn't until I was at university where I just accidentally stumbled across a video of someone playing their save on Facebook, actually, of all places.
Tom Kelsey:And so I was like, oh, I did not know this world existed where people made.
Tom Kelsey:Because, you know, having grown up in that sort of early YouTube world, I knew every other game was on YouTube.
Tom Kelsey:Minecraft, so popular.
Tom Kelsey:Used to watch a lot of that growing up.
Tom Kelsey:And so it was a surprise to me that Football Manager had a space on YouTube or the Internet, essentially.
Tom Kelsey:And so I watched this guy for a little bit, and then he said in one of his videos, I remember specifically he said, we need more people creating Football manager videos on YouTube, because there's a very small community.
Tom Kelsey:We need more people doing it to grow the community.
Tom Kelsey:And, you know, eventually that's collectively growing everyone.
Tom Kelsey:And at this point, I had a lot of free time at university.
Tom Kelsey:I had been rowing as part of the rowing team, but then I'd stopped to focus a bit more on actually getting good grades, because that was what I was kind of there for, really.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, there is that.
Tom Kelsey:There is that as well.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:So I decided.
Tom Kelsey:But always free time because we were training, you know, an awful lot.
Tom Kelsey:It had so much free time.
Tom Kelsey:I was like, okay, I'm going to give this a go.
Tom Kelsey:I'm going to see what I can do.
Tom Kelsey:I think I can do it better than other people that are making content.
Tom Kelsey:Let's see what happens.
Tom Kelsey:And it just took off from There really.
Tom Kelsey: ade my first video in January: Tom Kelsey:Where it became viable to be a full time job.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Wow.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And you went to universities?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You didn't go to university to study gaming?
Tom Kelsey:No, I did history and international relations which is as far away as you can get really from that kind of stuff.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:History and international relations.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:At uni you start well, continue playing football manager but see like a call to action of we need our football manager community to assemble.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, essentially that.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That's amazing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So what was your original plan, you know, going into uni to study those specific, like pretty intense subjects?
Tom Kelsey:I didn't really have much of a plan, to be fair.
Tom Kelsey:I don't think I ever really knew what I wanted to do growing up.
Tom Kelsey:I think when people ask me I just throw out a generic job that I thought sounded good.
Tom Kelsey:I think for a long time I told people, yeah, I want to be a lawyer just because, you know, I had no idea really.
Tom Kelsey:But it was a sort of aspirational job that I saw the people sort of wanting.
Tom Kelsey:So I just thought I'll say it to people to just sort of, you know, get out the conversation kind of thing.
Tom Kelsey:But I had no idea.
Tom Kelsey:History was always my favorite subject at school.
Tom Kelsey:I really enjoyed politics as well.
Tom Kelsey:It helped that my former tutor at school was a gov pole teacher.
Tom Kelsey:So I think that's kind of where that sort of interest came from because he was always talking about it.
Tom Kelsey:So I think my logic really was just okay, if I'm going to study for three more years, I'm going to follow my passions and interests in those sort of areas and I'll do that because if I'm going to go for three years, I may as well enjoy what I'm studying because a lot of my friends went in to do career specific degrees and just found it really jarring.
Tom Kelsey:Couldn't quite get into it.
Tom Kelsey:It was a bit of a slog at times.
Tom Kelsey:So that was my sort of thinking behind it.
Tom Kelsey:Follow the passions and interests and you know, see where it takes us.
Tom Kelsey:And I guess that's kind of what happened as well.
Tom Kelsey:Get into the whole YouTube thing, you know, I'd always had a bit of an interest in making videos.
Tom Kelsey:If you go back to when I was in primary school, me and my friend, a little video camera, really rubbish, little thing really.
Tom Kelsey:But me and my friends, we used to make videos on that.
Tom Kelsey:You know, we come up the weekends and me and my friends, we'd film, we'd Script a video, make it, and then edit it on a.
Tom Kelsey:It was like Windows Movie Maker at the time.
Tom Kelsey:So there's always that kind of interest.
Tom Kelsey:There was always that interest in the background, I think, of making videos, I guess, so I guess I kind of always had that.
Tom Kelsey:And so, yeah, I guess the whole YouTube thing was.
Tom Kelsey:That's an interest.
Tom Kelsey:I could get involved in that.
Tom Kelsey:And it was a bit of a passion that sort of followed through.
Tom Kelsey:And so I guess that's kind of what I've always done.
Tom Kelsey:Just followed interests and passions and it's.
Tom Kelsey:It's worked out quite well for me so far.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:See, that's really interesting because there's so many, like, people I meet who have multiple interests at once and they always feel like they have to sacrifice one of them to follow the other one.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But it seemed like you have this perfect balance of.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Educationally, I'm good at this, so I'll just keep going down that route.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Socially, I quite like Rowan and everything involved in that.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And then virtually this is my game that I.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That I really enjoy.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And you just let all three streams continue to move forward together.
Tom Kelsey:Exactly.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:I think there's no, there's no serious critical thinking going on when I'm deciding to do all these things.
Tom Kelsey:It's just, it's an interest.
Tom Kelsey:Let's follow it, see what happens, you know.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I may as well enjoy myself when I'm going through life.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Have you ever been someone who puts high pressure on yourself, like with all.
Tom Kelsey:Of these different interests?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Have you ever been like a.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I need to be the best, I need to be that high level.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Is there like that internal drive to smash it?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Are you quite competitive?
Tom Kelsey:There is with YouTube?
Tom Kelsey:100%.
Tom Kelsey:I've always had that.
Tom Kelsey:You know, as much as, like other people making content are my friends, you know, I've got to know a lot of these guys over the years and, you know, they're, excuse me, great people and I really like them all.
Tom Kelsey:It is still a competition in my head.
Tom Kelsey:It's like, I'm going to get more subscribers than you, I'm going to get some more views than you sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So I've always had that with YouTube and there's always that drive to.
Tom Kelsey:To do for bigger numbers.
Tom Kelsey:I think the YouTube thing is there's so many numbers involved with it and it's always trying to break through.
Tom Kelsey:And so actually, I think in recent years I have struggled a little bit with being satisfied and, you know, celebrating the key milestones because for a long time I remember a hundred thousand subscribers was like, oh, my word, that's an incredible number of people.
Tom Kelsey:I remember lying in bed sometimes at night, you know, you can't quite sleep and you start thinking about that kind of stuff and thinking how exciting that would be when you hit that huge number of 100,006 figures.
Tom Kelsey:But then it sort of gets to a point where you're at 80, 90,000 subscribers and it's like, okay, this is now inevitable.
Tom Kelsey:It's going to happen, right?
Tom Kelsey:And then some of that excitement sort of fell away a little bit.
Tom Kelsey:And I Remember on the YouTube channel, you can watch, like your live subscriber feed, I remember sitting there at, you know, 990, 999,000, nearly 99,999 sort of thing, just waiting for that one more to tick over.
Tom Kelsey:And yeah, it was a great moment, but it's like as soon as it happened, it wasn't like a huge, you know, feeling of elation or anything like that.
Tom Kelsey:It was like, right, a hundred thousand, that's cool.
Tom Kelsey:Let's.
Tom Kelsey:Let's work to get 200,000 sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So I need to do a better job of trying to celebrate those moments and not focus quite so much on the drive to just beat everyone else and get more and more and more rights.
Tom Kelsey:But in terms of, you know, academics at school or rowing, for example.
Tom Kelsey:Academic at school particularly, I was more interested in having fun with my friends more than anything else.
Tom Kelsey:I maybe coasted through school a little bit too much kind of thing.
Tom Kelsey:There was never really a drive to, you know, do better than, get better grades than my friends sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:I was more interested in who was going to score goals at lunchtime.
Tom Kelsey:Football sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:Right?
Tom Kelsey:That was kind of where my thoughts let school a little bit more, rowing as well.
Tom Kelsey:Like, you know, you always want to be the best and beat other people, but I think physically there were just bigger, stronger guys there.
Tom Kelsey:And I knew that.
Tom Kelsey:I knew that, you know, these guys were always going to beat me.
Tom Kelsey:So I just do what I can do best I can.
Tom Kelsey:But I was never going to be the top dog at the club there because there were just some, you know, guys doing GB trials sort of thing, right?
Tom Kelsey:And they could push themselves mentally a lot further physically, know what I mean?
Tom Kelsey:Like, yeah, when I'm, you know, when we're deep into a half an hour, you know, row machine session sort of thing, like, and I can start to feel the pain, I'm easing off, you know, I've always struggled to sort of physically push through that pain barrier, whereas these Other guys just didn't have that in their heads sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So they would be able to push themselves through that pain barrier and they'd be falling off the machine, you know, in that 30 minute session, you know, gasping for air sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:But they just pulled like an amazing time.
Tom Kelsey:So that, that's why I was never, I knew for a long time I was never going to be that sort of level.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I'm going to enjoy myself and you know, do as well as I can, but I'm never going to be at top level.
Tom Kelsey:I think that's probably why I made my piece there.
Tom Kelsey:So I never quite pushed myself so much there, I think.
Tom Kelsey:But yeah, when it came to YouTube and stuff, it's yeah, totally different.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Do you think if you'd applied the level of competition and sort of dedication, maybe obsession that you have with your YouTube stuff into school education, into rowing, that you could achieve top grades in there or, or could be GB trialist or do you think there were like other limitations that it just.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:No matter how hard you tried in certain areas, it wasn't for you?
Tom Kelsey:I think maybe academically, yeah, potentially, like I say it was a bit more of a.
Tom Kelsey:I remember our teacher in sick form specifically had to have a say, had to have a conversation with him.
Tom Kelsey:We had a conversation and he basically sat me down, was like, Tom, you're having too much fun basically.
Tom Kelsey:You know, because I was always a little bit more of the class clown sort of type, you know, a bit more.
Tom Kelsey:No, maybe I did sort of want to be center of attention sometimes.
Tom Kelsey:I don't know.
Tom Kelsey:I guess that kind of makes sense with YouTube, right?
Tom Kelsey:Because you know, it's not like I'm putting myself on YouTube because I'm a introvert, nervous wreck sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:You know, you've got.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I don't want to be seen.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Don't actually look at my YouTube channel.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, exactly.
Tom Kelsey:So there was, yeah, I just had a lot of fun in school.
Tom Kelsey:I was always just there to, you know, with your best friends, every single day.
Tom Kelsey:It was great.
Tom Kelsey:I loved it.
Tom Kelsey:That's what I enjoyed so much.
Tom Kelsey:So I think had I maybe knuckled down a bit more perhaps could have got some better grades.
Tom Kelsey:In fact, I think my predicted grades, I don't think I hit any of them for A levels sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So you know, that, that maybe shows that.
Tom Kelsey:But I think in terms of the rowing stuff, like I just think there's always been this thing inbuilt in my head where when the pain starts, when you're doing some sort of physical exercise.
Tom Kelsey:It's like, okay, let's.
Tom Kelsey:Let's ease off a little bit.
Tom Kelsey:I just can't.
Tom Kelsey:I always try and break through that.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I'm in the gym quite a bit and, you know you're trying to get to exhaustion for muscle growth.
Tom Kelsey:Right.
Tom Kelsey:But as soon as it starts to get tricky, it's kind of like, no, let's ease up.
Tom Kelsey:Let's not hurt yourself or I don't know what it is.
Tom Kelsey:So whatever that is, I can never get around that.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:See, that's so interesting that sort of.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Academically you knew what you were doing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You knew if you could turn it on if you wanted to, but you prioritize the social.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But that sounds like a genuine decision.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Not like you couldn't, but yes, 100%.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Which makes sense.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Whereas with the physical stuff, it was actually like, I don't want to.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And I don't think I can push past that point.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:This is where I'm good.
Tom Kelsey:I think so, Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:I just, I can never, never.
Tom Kelsey:Whatever it is in my brain, it just stops me.
Tom Kelsey:And I try to override it all the time, but it never quite works.
Tom Kelsey:Maybe can override it for like, you know, an extra rep or two, but by the time you're on a third set or something and you know, on bench press, it's like, okay, let's.
Tom Kelsey:Let's pull this off and stop now.
Tom Kelsey:I don't know.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, I mean, you and I go to the same, same box engine, right?
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And I, I know even there, there's different approaches to it where some people like slogging it out and every spa is going to be real.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And then some of them like, hey, I'm just trying to get fit and in shape.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And it's got that community of everyone at different levels or doing it in different ways.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:The reason I dig into it so much is because there's this idea that how you do anything leaks into how you do everything.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So, yeah, if you're someone who physically, in those workouts, etc, might take your foot off the gas and that will leak into your education.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You take foot off the gas and that will leak into your YouTube and take.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But quite clearly that's not the case.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You've got those elements where it's like, that's just enjoyment.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But the YouTube is like a different Tom.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's like, right, I'm going to be consistent.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I'm posted out.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I'm going to make sure each video is more entertaining than the last.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yep, you're my friend, love what you're doing, but in my head, I'm coming for you.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, it is turned on there.
Tom Kelsey:It is really strange, actually, how there is that difference and how I can recognize that so much as well, I think.
Tom Kelsey:But you're right, it is like two different sort of versions in a way, you know, especially with YouTube, you know, my girlfriend will tell you about it, like, you know, I can spend all night, you know, sat there editing a video and she'll get cross about that sort of thing and, you know.
Tom Kelsey:But again, it doesn't feel like work.
Tom Kelsey:It doesn't feel like a job.
Tom Kelsey:It's not a chore.
Tom Kelsey:It's a pleasure that I get to do this and I love doing it so much, which is why, you know, I.
Tom Kelsey:I do more work than I would do in a normal job.
Tom Kelsey:I'm 100% sure of that.
Tom Kelsey:More hours and stuff.
Tom Kelsey:But it's so much more fulfilling and enjoyable.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Would you say you've.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You're obsessed with that world?
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, probably.
Tom Kelsey:I probably am, to be fair.
Tom Kelsey:I think it'll be a fair assessment.
Tom Kelsey:It's not so much obsessed with, you know, watching other YouTube videos or consuming content.
Tom Kelsey:It's an obsession with.
Tom Kelsey:It is like a video game to me, I guess, in a way.
Tom Kelsey:You know, the high score is, you know, what's the highest view video I've got, sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So how am I going to beat that high score?
Tom Kelsey:You know, subscriber numbers is a game, you know, I'm trying to get that to that next.
Tom Kelsey:The next level, you know, the next level up of, you know, 200,000, 300,000 sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So I think I maybe sit a bit more like that.
Tom Kelsey:And it's.
Tom Kelsey:I'm constantly trying to beat myself and improve myself.
Tom Kelsey:And then when you see the rewards come through from it as well, like, you know, that's quite a dopamine hit, I suppose.
Tom Kelsey:And you want to try and beat that as well.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That's.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's properly fascinating because there is this thing of finding your thing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And I believe you go from someone who's high potential to high performance.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And there's this journey you go through and people get.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:People stop at each stage of journey.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So you might have high potential, then you get to a point where you're coasting, where you know you could work harder and do better.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You also know you could be worse and fail.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So you sit in the middle comfortably.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Then some people move on and they become better than everyone around them.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And then there's that new level of just high performers.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Who are just out there going for it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And in that world of YouTube, you are in that high performance category where you've got so many subscribers there loving what you do.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You consistently create new, interesting content and you're not stopping, you're not going, yeah, hey, I hit 100K.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I got, I got that.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You're in that full performance mode.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:What sacrifices have you found you've had to make to get to that level of performance?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I think from the outside, some people who've never tried YouTube are very ignorant to what it takes.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's like, oh, you just, what, you play games and record videos and call that a living.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I could do that.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Until they upload a video and there's three views, they're like, hmm, what's going on here?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So for you, what sacrifices have you had to make to really hit that level?
Tom Kelsey:So it's difficult because I think I'm so focused on growing, developing and getting better sort of thing that to me things maybe don't feel as much of a sacrifice because it's just what I love doing, you know, I'm so lucky to do what I do, I'm in love with it sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:But I'm sure other people around me will say, well, actually, you know, you don't spend as much time with us as you would do if you had a normal job.
Tom Kelsey:You know, you maybe aren't as attentive as you perhaps should be.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I could check my WhatsApp now and I know there's going to be four or five missed messages from like two weeks ago from friends that I haven't replied to yet, just because I see the message be like, okay, I'm working on this right now, I'll reply later on and then swap notification away.
Tom Kelsey:And it's like, oh, that then gone up for my brain sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So I think, I think maybe I need to do a better job of that sort of work, life balance and because, yeah, it's probably not so fair that I'm a bit more distant than I should be kind of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So I think that's probably the biggest one that I get called upon a lot kind of thing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, like a social sacrifice of which makes sense.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You're editing all night, you're then going to be a bit tired in the morning when they start chatting and I could go out, but I also could finish this perfect little bit.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:And I think, I think as well sometimes, you know, I've always enjoyed being active and stuff like that, you know, whether been rowing at Uni or against the gym quite a bit now boxing as well, obviously with you recently.
Tom Kelsey:So.
Tom Kelsey:But I will always prioritize work over those things.
Tom Kelsey:So if I know I'm slightly behind on something, it's like, okay, I won't go to the gym this morning, I'm going to just get it straight away, get working.
Tom Kelsey:So that's a bit of a sacrifice, I think, you know, work.
Tom Kelsey:And you know what?
Tom Kelsey:When I wasn't a full time YouTuber because in between graduating uni and going full time, I did work, I had an actual real job for a little bit.
Tom Kelsey:And at that actual real job all the time, I was like, now you should not prioritize work.
Tom Kelsey:You know, this company are keeping me here for eight hours.
Tom Kelsey:If they expect me to do like an extra hour on top of that, you know, that's not in my contract.
Tom Kelsey:I'm not doing that.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I've got to look after me first.
Tom Kelsey:But then suddenly when I'm, you know, self employed, doing it my own sort of thing, that all changes because suddenly what I'm doing something I really enjoy, but also the bottom line ends with me.
Tom Kelsey:Right.
Tom Kelsey:If that's the right way to say it.
Tom Kelsey:And so suddenly work is then the most important thing because if I don't do the work, I'm not getting the rewards from it, you know, I'm not getting paid.
Tom Kelsey:And then I have to go and get a real job again.
Tom Kelsey:I'm so I do not want to get a real job again sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:And at some point in life I will have to, you know, everyone on the Internet, everyone on YouTube has got a shelf life.
Tom Kelsey:You know, at some point, at some point someone younger, better looking, more relatable will come along, take the views and there will be a downward trend.
Tom Kelsey:It happens with everyone on YouTube.
Tom Kelsey:You know, a lot of the guys I would watch when I was younger growing up, you know, and had millions of subscribers.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:Although they still have million subscribers now.
Tom Kelsey:You look at the videos they get and it's like, you know, they're getting less views than, than I do on a much smaller channel sort of thing in a much smaller niche.
Tom Kelsey:And so everyone's got a shelf life on YouTube.
Tom Kelsey:At some point mine will end and I will have to change things up a little bit.
Tom Kelsey:So I think that's also part of the, the drive of putting work first.
Tom Kelsey:I want to just do as well as I can right now for as long as I can before inevitably at some point, you know, things slow down.
Tom Kelsey:So that's a huge Drive, I think, actually.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So there's a real self.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Self awareness is, I think, key to life and you have so much self awareness.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's quite amazing to know that this thing has a self, a shelf life and feel like at some point it's going to dip.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Is that one of the main drivers that gets you to do it?
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, I think so massively.
Tom Kelsey:Because, you know, at the moment things are going pretty well and it's a nice earner and stuff like that.
Tom Kelsey:And so, you know, I want to get as much out of it as possible.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I'll evolve and adapt over the years, I think.
Tom Kelsey:I feel like I have done that pretty well over seven years.
Tom Kelsey:A lot changes in seven years and my content has changed quite a bit and I'm sure it will change a lot in the next, you know, seven years, hopefully going forward kind of thing.
Tom Kelsey:And so that will.
Tom Kelsey:There will be change in adaptions, but adaptations rather.
Tom Kelsey:But yeah, at some point, you know, viewers will lose interest and they will move to other things and it's impossible for me to keep up with every single change of trend and audience wants.
Tom Kelsey:So, you know, at some point it will come to an end.
Tom Kelsey:So I'm going to just try and smash it as long as I can, you know, do as well as I can right now.
Tom Kelsey:And then inevitably when it happens, you know, I can say, look, I did a great job for all those years, had a great time doing it, you know, it's fine.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Wow, that's.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That's amazing to hear because it sounds you.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It comes out of this genre that we have of like, you know, a YouTuber.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:They can do it in essence forever.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Your subscribers will be there.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Once you've got that many subscribers, I'll keep on watching.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But from the inside, it's completely different view.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It sounds so similar to professional sports in the sense of there's a.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:And I think that there's a shift.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, I think for me, actually I am lucky that my audience generally is a bit older on the grounds that, you know, it's not teenagers really watching my content.
Tom Kelsey:Football manager tends to have an older demographic and so I think because of that I will have a bit more longevity because as an adult, your interests don't change massively.
Tom Kelsey:I think, you know, for me growing up, right, you know, some, like I mentioned earlier, the guys I watched growing up, suddenly these days they don't get, you know, the same views that they used to get.
Tom Kelsey:You know, essentially people would say they've fallen off, they haven't, you know, it's just a change of essentially their audience grew up, got different interests and stopped watching what they used to watch when they were younger.
Tom Kelsey:And the next generation finds something else slightly more interesting sort of things.
Tom Kelsey:Those creators don't quite get the same.
Tom Kelsey:It's not like they're replenishing the audience because the interest change.
Tom Kelsey:They haven't adapted so much.
Tom Kelsey:So I think I'm slightly.
Tom Kelsey:I've got a bit more longevity because my own is older kind of thing.
Tom Kelsey:But at some point, you know, business.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, yeah, it's proper business, if you.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Will look at, you know, don't give YouTube is the titles of entrepreneurs or that kind of thing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's just you're a YouTuber.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But yeah, it's such a business.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You've got a target market in mind, you know what they want when their needs change.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You adapt your product and service to meet it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You've got to be consistent so that they're happy with that end product and it's good.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And you go in different partnerships and different directions to make sure it's sustainable, like.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And you're looking at past businesses that have, that have dipped and going, what happened?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:How do I avoid it?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:There's so much more to it than I think there is that people assume there is.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:From the outside, it's amazing to hear the inner thoughts.
Tom Kelsey:It is 100%, I think, like you say, a lot of people who ask me what I do, just assume you sit from the computer, just play a bit of a game, put it on YouTube.
Tom Kelsey:The whole thought process behind decision making like that, you know, but also, you know, from the angle of, you know, actually making the video to get people to watch.
Tom Kelsey:It's got to be entertaining, it's got to be engaging.
Tom Kelsey:And a whole load of thought process goes into, you know, scripting things out to make sure it's set in a way that is entertaining and engaging, leaves open questions that the audience want answers to later on and how you can sort of manipulate things that way to try and get people to stick around and watch more.
Tom Kelsey:So, yeah, there's a whole process in terms of actually creating a good video.
Tom Kelsey:It's more than just sitting down and saying like, this is what we're doing today and then just start kicking a few buttons.
Tom Kelsey:The whole process of stuff.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, that's awesome.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So at what point in this journey are you doing it and getting nothing back?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You know, from.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:From starting day one of going, I'm going to make a YouTube channel.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:How long are you putting in this work, being consistent and the world is not giving you anything back to say that you're going to be a high performer.
Tom Kelsey:So the first year was not tricky, but it's more like the first year was all about learning.
Tom Kelsey:And I think I went into it thinking, if I want to grow, I've just got to make loads of videos and learn how to make a good video sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So the first.
Tom Kelsey:It was probably the first 10 months where really you'd put a video out and if it got, you know, 25, 30, 40 views, it was like, oh, that's a good video, that's done well sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So that first year really was kind of like a lot of learning.
Tom Kelsey:You know, you're not making any money off it.
Tom Kelsey:It's all about just the repetitions and practicing.
Tom Kelsey:And so you are getting something out of it because you're learning every video you make.
Tom Kelsey:But it's not like you're getting any financial rewards out of it.
Tom Kelsey:You're not really getting much interaction from audience members at that point because it's such a small audience, you know, you're not getting many views.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:And then it was.
Tom Kelsey: So I started with January: Tom Kelsey:And then, yeah, just before the end of the year, I think I hit a thousand subscribers.
Tom Kelsey:And that was like, wow, it's taken a year to get a thousand subscribers.
Tom Kelsey:That's incredible.
Tom Kelsey:I can't believe how fast I've done that.
Tom Kelsey:I think I remember saying wow at the time sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:And, you know, these days, you know, if I don't get a thousand subscribers in like a week, it's kind of like that was a really bad week sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So, yeah, it changes massively.
Tom Kelsey:Wow.
Tom Kelsey:Kind of thing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So, yeah, that year of just, I'm grinding it out and I'm going to keep doing it regardless of what comes back my way 100%.
Tom Kelsey:And then I think then the road to 10,000, that took a few years to be fair, to get to 10,000 subscribers off the back of that.
Tom Kelsey:But again, you know, I was putting the repetition in knowing how to make a good, you know, learning how to make better videos and stuff over that time.
Tom Kelsey:So it wasn't wasted, you know, and I was making, you know, some pocket money on the side sort of thing with that kind of stuff.
Tom Kelsey:And yeah, 10,000 subscribers, that was like another huge milestone, you know, the next sort of.
Tom Kelsey:Yes, that's five figures then.
Tom Kelsey:So going from there and then having a long hard look at Saying, okay, how do I get to 100,000 subscribers?
Tom Kelsey:Things have got to change because the growth hasn't been quite what I expect at that point.
Tom Kelsey:Maybe a few new people are coming to the scene and maybe overtaking me a little bit, I was like, okay, so what are they doing that I'm not, that I need to do better.
Tom Kelsey:And essentially my sort of big issue was that I was doing the same stuff as everyone else.
Tom Kelsey:So foot manager content up to that point really had just been, let's start a long save with a club.
Tom Kelsey:So I sport Lincoln City.
Tom Kelsey:Let's say I did Lincoln City and you started episode one of your, you know, the first day of the first season, you're in charge and that gets quite a lot of you clips.
Tom Kelsey:Episode one, I was like, oh, that's a new series, let's watch that.
Tom Kelsey:Then suddenly episode two comes along.
Tom Kelsey:But there's not so many people watching that video because some people didn't quite the first episode, for example, and thought, it's not for me.
Tom Kelsey:I won't bother.
Tom Kelsey:From that point on, when you're doing episode two, no one new is joining that journey sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:And so I would be, you know, 100 episodes deep and thinking, why is, why is no one really watching this?
Tom Kelsey:I think it's great.
Tom Kelsey:I love this.
Tom Kelsey:And although I'm enjoying it myself and the people who love it, no one new is joining episode 100 and they're not going to go back and watch for episode one and watch 100 episodes to catch up sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:And so that was the sort of big mistake I was having.
Tom Kelsey:And so I switched style to sort of just do one off videos, essentially, you know, where I'd be changing something in the game's database.
Tom Kelsey:You know, for example, I would give, you know, a team in the National League, a billion pounds, let's see what they can do sort of thing with that billion pounds over the next 50 years, for example.
Tom Kelsey:And so the switch to those sorts of videos is like, ah, this is a new video every single time someone watches this.
Tom Kelsey:It's not like they're.
Tom Kelsey:They need the context of the previous 99 videos.
Tom Kelsey:These appeal to a whole new audience of people who have not seen my content before.
Tom Kelsey:Every video is a chance for a new person to come along.
Tom Kelsey:And so that sort of switching content, yeah, really accelerated things.
Tom Kelsey:And so I think I hit 100,000 subscribers.
Tom Kelsey:It was last year at some point.
Tom Kelsey:And so that was probably maybe around this time last year, maybe June, July, sort of last year, I think I hit 100,000.
Tom Kelsey:And so I've kept with that formula sort of since then and now in the space of 12 months, I've almost got another hundred thousand subscribers.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, like 194 now.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:So we're just shy of 200,000 at the moment.
Tom Kelsey:So, yeah, that sort of switch has been remarkable.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, that's amazing.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:Trying to make sure every video is as accessible as possible to a whole new audience every single time.
Tom Kelsey:So they don't need any sort of context as to, you know, the previous videos.
Tom Kelsey:It's all there pretty much, and anyone new can join in whenever.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So we've gone from a year to a thousand, another two, three years to get to that 10,000, another few years to get to 100,000, but then 100 to nearly 200,000 in around 12 months.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, yeah, maybe a little bit over.
Tom Kelsey:12 months now, to be fair, but yeah, it's been a dramatic increase.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, that's amazing to show that if you stick it out and keep going, but not just repeating the same thing, I think that's what people get wrong.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Repetition is the master.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And it's like, yeah, if you're repeating the correct things, if you keep repeating the wrong things, you're going to go nowhere.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Whereas what you did is.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It sounds like you actually have the, the foresight to analyze and go, okay, I'm at this pace, especially that pace.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:What am I doing wrong?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And constantly almost reinventing your approach.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, it's all about being, you know, critical of yourself, I suppose.
Tom Kelsey:You know, as much as you, you make a video and you put it out there because you think it's good.
Tom Kelsey:Right.
Tom Kelsey:You're not going to put something out there that doesn't you think isn't good.
Tom Kelsey:But you also have to have the ability to actually look at it back and say, okay, right, this is what I did this time.
Tom Kelsey:Which bits weren't actually that good.
Tom Kelsey:Where do I need to improve?
Tom Kelsey:You know, it's all about being critical of your own work so you can, yeah, get better every single time, essentially.
Tom Kelsey:You know, there's no.
Tom Kelsey:You don't help yourself by settling and being, saying, that's good enough.
Tom Kelsey:Let's not think about that ever again.
Tom Kelsey:You've got to have that self awareness and be critical in order to grow and improve.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Amazing, amazing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:The lessons for life in your YouTube journey alone are.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:This is so real.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And I actually think you, you go against a lot of the stereotypes that we have of YouTubers in the world in the sense that, like, you're not someone who's unfit and out of shape and sat there with their Doritos pouring down as they're doing like the rowing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Your gym.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:We met in a boxing gym, for crying out loud.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Like, so you're looking after yourself in that sense.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You've got a girlfriend, which is.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:The real surprise.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:What?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Like the YouTubers that have girlfriends, they just sit on it and it's like actually the mentality you have has allowed you to have that really well balanced, well balanced approach where actually you are smashing it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And what was amazing to me of your numbers was 194,000 subscribers is amazing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:What was really amazing to me was the views per month, like 1.4 to 2 million.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, it's ridiculous.
Tom Kelsey: And you know, watch time in: Kamau Ellis Hyman:Was 3 million hours of people.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Like those numbers are crazy.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:And I can never quite get over it.
Tom Kelsey:Like the.
Tom Kelsey:Particularly the watch time hours.
Tom Kelsey:Let me just Google it now.
Tom Kelsey:3 million hours in days.
Tom Kelsey:Okay, let's change that to years because.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Because it's three.
Tom Kelsey:Three.
Tom Kelsey:My word.
Tom Kelsey:Three million hours in years equates to 342 and a half years.
Tom Kelsey:You know, obviously that's collectively, you know, people are watching at the same time sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:That's how it all works out.
Tom Kelsey:That's what I can never get over.
Tom Kelsey:Like that's how much time has been spent collectively watching just this year from January 1st up till now in August.
Tom Kelsey:That's what is.
Tom Kelsey:That's quite scary that.
Tom Kelsey:That's just when it sort of gets like, what on earth is.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, I looked at it as an Arsenal fan obviously of like the Emirates Stadium.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:How many times could you fill the Emirates in a.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, in a month watching you do football manager.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And it's 28 and a half.
Tom Kelsey:It's exactly what I used to do, you know, when I was going.
Tom Kelsey:I remember hitting 10,000, 10,000 like 130 subscribers.
Tom Kelsey:And being like, that is huge for me because a Lincoln City fan Central bank is I think 10,120.
Tom Kelsey:I was like, I can fill Sinsel Bank.
Tom Kelsey:Amazing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That's crazy.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That's like.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:And so.
Tom Kelsey:And then I'd, you know, update it every and again.
Tom Kelsey:Every milestone was like, oh, which stadium can I fill now?
Tom Kelsey:You know, can I get, you know, the Emirates, for example?
Tom Kelsey:So.
Tom Kelsey:But that's at the point where it's past every stadium.
Tom Kelsey:So it's like I can't compare it to a stadium now because there's no stadium.
Tom Kelsey:Exactly.
Tom Kelsey:It's like.
Tom Kelsey:But now I like to compare myself to Taylor Swift because now it's like, well, Taylor Swift can do eight nights sold out at Wembley, but if I got all my subscribers together in one place, we could do two nights at Wembley.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, that's where it starts to compare it to now, but which is quite funny.
Tom Kelsey:It amuses me in my head at least a little bit.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, yeah.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's an amazing context and I think the question a lot of people always have is, right, this YouTube journey has been a long one, which means you've had to have like, like you call them a normal job in the meantime.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But you made the decision to go full time.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Now, did you make decisions, go full time and hope that you'd make enough money to live or did it build up to a point where comparatively you're like, actually I could leave now.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's, it's set for me to be able to live.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:So it was very calculated.
Tom Kelsey:I always say it was a calculated risk because, you know, mergers backfired immediately.
Tom Kelsey:Luckily it didn't.
Tom Kelsey: So: Tom Kelsey:And so it was quite lucky actually.
Tom Kelsey:Someone who wasn't part time hours where I worked was leaving.
Tom Kelsey:And so I was like, okay, can I take their part time hours.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And.
Tom Kelsey:I'll drop down to part time three days a week and then those other two days I can just solely focus on YouTube and then working on better content, taking things to the next level.
Tom Kelsey:Which worked out brilliantly.
Tom Kelsey:That was a lovely nice.
Tom Kelsey:In between they were making similar amounts sort of thing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:So it worked quite nicely.
Tom Kelsey:It wasn't like it was a big drop in income or anything like that.
Tom Kelsey:You know, they were at that point earning quite similar.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So that dropped from full time to part time, that gaps being filled by YouTube.
Tom Kelsey:Yes, exactly.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Full time wage in half the time of the great.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, precisely.
Tom Kelsey:And so the next year I was part time and the channel grew quite nicely to the point where roughly monthly it would have equaled what I would have made if I was full time at the council where I worked.
Tom Kelsey:So at that point I was like, okay, now is the time, I should probably make that jump sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:And it was scary because, you know, there was always the chance this could just all go wrong all of a sudden and then it would all crumble and burn.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But the temptation of, well, hold on, I've got this thing over here making my full Wage.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I'm still getting the other half here.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Let me spend that difference on a nicer car.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Let me go.
Tom Kelsey:Exactly.
Tom Kelsey:There was that temptation as well.
Tom Kelsey:100%, you know, that extra bit of disposable income, you know, it gets quite nice.
Tom Kelsey:You like?
Tom Kelsey:Okay.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I could get used to this sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:But I think what helped was that I despised the job I was doing.
Tom Kelsey:I did not enjoy that at all.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That always helps.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:If anything, there were probably more push factors than pull factor, I think because I just did not enjoy what I was doing sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:And you know, I've been working towards that for a long time, you know.
Tom Kelsey: , it got to August next year,: Tom Kelsey:It stayed stable for a few months of earning quite nice.
Tom Kelsey:I thought, okay, let's just make the jump.
Tom Kelsey:Let's do it now.
Tom Kelsey:The word my mentality was the worst case scenario is I have to get an actual job again.
Tom Kelsey:And if that's the worst thing that can happen, it's not that bad.
Tom Kelsey:So, yeah, made the jump and then never looked back.
Tom Kelsey:Since then it's just gone from strength to strength.
Tom Kelsey:Grown massively since then and yeah, it's been the best decision I ever made.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That's awesome.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So like financially now, at this stage, looking at your year ahead, like, what's your, what's your target?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Where are you trying to get this to from?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah, so turnover income standpoint.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, this, this financial year, April to March, the target is a hundred thousand pounds in revenue.
Tom Kelsey:You know, if we can do that, that would be insane.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I don't know what else I would be doing that would earn me near that sort of money sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:So I'm very fortunate that I've been able to, you know, go on this journey and grow that sort of stuff.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And that's at age 27, aiming to be on a six figure turnover from a game you love and would play anyway.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah, exactly, exactly.
Tom Kelsey:It is bonkers.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Editing videos, which you love to do anyway.
Tom Kelsey:100%.
Tom Kelsey:It's, that's amazing.
Tom Kelsey:Is a complete dream come true.
Tom Kelsey:Like I said at the start, you know, I've got to pinch myself sometimes that I, I feel like I'm cheating at life.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I'm.
Tom Kelsey:And it won't last forever.
Tom Kelsey:Like I say, I have to run myself all the time.
Tom Kelsey:It won't last forever.
Tom Kelsey:You know, let's not get too high on it.
Tom Kelsey:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:But also, you know, don't get too low thinking about, you know, it's going to end at some point.
Tom Kelsey:You know, it's a good thing, but it's going to end at some point because, you know, then you've been on that whole journey and, you know, I've grown so much as a person and done so much and have been so fortunate to do it so.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And honestly, the.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:The skills you're picking up on this, like, you, you are talking in a language that is of business consultancy, that is of like business leadership.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:The way you analyze your channel, the way you've broken down.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Look, you're going to start here.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Here's how long we're going to have to prove the concept and don't worry about the feedback as long as there's something coming in.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And then here's how we get to the next scale.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And like all the way you've broken it down, the way you look at it, the way you analyze it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I know from the outside people are just hearing YouTube talk, but if you really listen to what Tom's saying, this is business talk of how you take any idea from concept to viable to scale, and it's awesome.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So I have no doubt, like, even when this does dry out for you, that you'll just shift gears and do the same thing again somewhere else because you've got it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Which is.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Which is absolutely awesome.
Tom Kelsey:I hope so.
Tom Kelsey:You know, there's always that worry of what comes next sort of thing.
Tom Kelsey:But again, like, you know, at the moment, things aren't showing any signs of slowing down, so it's not like I'm actively thinking about, you know, what comes next.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Yeah.
Tom Kelsey:And so amazing.
Tom Kelsey:You know, I work it out when it comes to that point.
Tom Kelsey:But yeah, I think that the skills I've picked up is, you know, I'm doing all sorts of stuff in terms of, you know, production and business and all that kind of stuff.
Tom Kelsey:So, you know, at some point, someone's got to find that valuable somewhere down the line.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So a hundred percent, that's amazing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And you got real clear that, that clarity.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:There's crystal clear that I love of, like, here's what I'm good at, here's what I'm okay at, here's what I could be great at.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:But I don't know if the sacrifice is worth it for that.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Then you find the thing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I like it, I love it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I know there's a big sacrifice to get good enough, but it's worth making, so I'm gonna go on that journey.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And now some of the things you're doing are awesome.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:So as we all know Southgate has retired from the England job now, right?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:He's let it go and we need a replacement now.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Unless between now and the time this podcast is launched, that place is filled.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I think.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:I think the problem's already been solved.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Because you've had the call, right?
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You are ready to manage England.
Tom Kelsey:I have had the call to manage England, although only virtually.
Tom Kelsey:So maybe, maybe if I do well at this, this World cup tournament, I'll be able to go on and take the actual job.
Tom Kelsey:But, yeah, so E8 used to make a game called FIFA and then they lost the FIFA license, so it's now called eafc and FIFA had their own esports division called FIFA E.
Tom Kelsey:And so they used to run tournaments played on FIFA, the video game, for years and years and years.
Tom Kelsey:But since that partnership broke, they're now venturing into other games.
Tom Kelsey:So I think they do a lot with Rocket League, for example, but they're also starting to do some stuff with football manager.
Tom Kelsey:And so there's a FIFA E Football Manager World cup coming up, which very fortunately I'm taking part in.
Tom Kelsey:So a friend of mine who also makes content is called Jack.
Tom Kelsey:Weirdly, bizarrely, we went to the exact same school, didn't know Itchill at school because he was a few years above me, but weirdly, he went to the same school, grew up locally sort of stuff.
Tom Kelsey:So that was really bizarre.
Tom Kelsey:And we found that out randomly on a discord call one night.
Tom Kelsey:But he said, by the way, Tom, I've just had this, this call from, from the English Football Association.
Tom Kelsey:They want me to be the manager for this upcoming FIFA E World cup, but I need an assistant manager.
Tom Kelsey:Do you want to be my assistant manager?
Tom Kelsey:So immediately I was like, yes, get me involved in that.
Tom Kelsey:I would love to.
Tom Kelsey:So as we record this next week, we're in Liverpool all week to take part in this Football Manager World cup against, I think it's 16 other countries potentially, who have all picked people from their countries to represent, which is hilarious in a way.
Tom Kelsey:And as we, as we record this tomorrow, we're going down to Wembley for a photo shoot to announce the managers of England, which is hilarious.
Tom Kelsey:So, yeah, there's some wacky stuff that can come out from this.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:That is just awesome, Tom, honestly, thank you so much for your time.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:This has been so insightful.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:To hear the journey, see the mind that is behind such a successful channel that this is not luck at all.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:This is work and clarity and confidence and communication.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:It's beautiful.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:People need to go and subscribe.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:You need to go to YouTube.com tomf and on Twitter it's Tom FM/YT.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Get connected.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Go and watch some of these videos and go and follow the journey to see if England can win the World cup with Tom.
Tom Kelsey:I'll do my best.
Tom Kelsey:I'll try and bring it home.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Oh, it's amazing.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Thank you so much for your time.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:This has been really insightful.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:We really appreciate it.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:And keep going out there and keep performing, man.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:We love to see it and look forward to seeing where it goes.
Tom Kelsey:No, thank you.
Tom Kelsey:It's been a pleasure to be on here.
Tom Kelsey:Thanks for chatting.
Kamau Ellis Hyman:Legend.
